Tuesday, November 6, 2012

Questionable Star Wars vol. 1

Let's shift gears and talk about Star Wars! Like Trek, Star Wars changed the world. It became a pillar of our culture, as influential as that Shakespeane dude or Max Twain. It also dominated so many of our childhoods. And in light of that. . .

Question: "What was the best moment in all of the Star Wars films?"

Scott's Answer: The best moment for me is the asteroid chase in The Empire Strikes Back. It's a perfectly-executed self-contained sequence in a film that already has a lot going for it. It's a wonderful melding of sound design, music, editing, witty dialogue, and amazing visuals courtesy of ILM. And this was pre-CGI - each asteroid had to be constructed and photographed separately. Also, a few years ago I was able to see "The Asteroid Chase" music performed live by an orchestra... simply amazing.

Andrew's Answer: I'm going to the same place, but a different direction than Scott. The best moment in all the films is indeed in the asteroid field, but it's after the chase, when they are fixing the Falcon and Han and Leia have their big scene together... right until C-3PO interrupts them. What a great moment which gives the films real heart, and it pays off so incredibly well about an hour later with, "I love you"... "I know." :)

77 comments:

T-Rav said...

Wow, that's not even a fair question. I'd have to go with the Death Star "canyon" chase sequence in the original, starting when Luke hears Obi-Wan talking to him, and then down to the thing blowing up. As Harry Plinkett would say, it's so well shot and written, I have a feeling George Lucas had nothing to do with it, and probably fought against including it.

AndrewPrice said...

LOL! Very Plinketty indeed! :)

K said...

The opening scene of the whole shebang, the Star Destroyer taking out the "diplomatic ship". I can support that opinion with the number of times it has been emulated subsequently.

Scott: IMO, 100 years from now, the "classical" music from this period will be the great motion picture music scores, not the avant garde stuff which has pretensions and little else going for it.

shawn said...

Going to have to agree with K. I remember seeing Star Wars back in '77 and when the shot panned down from the star field and the rebel cruiser flew into view followed by the Star Destroyer- Holy smokes, a shiver went down my spine and I knew the movie was going to be something special.

The asteroid sequence from Empire is a very close second.

Dave Olson said...

Just after Luke walks away from the dinner table (without finishing his glass of Aunt Beru's Blue Brew), he walks outside, kicks at the ground, and stares at the suns' set. As the magnificent score of John Williams swells around him, he contemplates the future, the world passing him by, and his sense that there has to more to life than moisture farming. A nearly perfect scene (made better by not having any of Lucas' clunky dialogue) to which any young person can relate.

Anonymous said...

I really like Ks and Dave Olsons picks, the opening scene just being visually stunning and shows you how powerful the Empire is and the second scene transcending Sci-Fi completely and showing human drama. And as Dave mentioned with his, both scenes contain no dialogue and are more powerful for it.

But for me the best moment was the ending of The Empire Strikes Back. It took the series beyond any other with the thought that the Rebels might not win, but they are the heroes and they have to win...

The idea alone of ending the movie with the heroes being in such dire straights was ground breaking and pulled off with a deft touch. It had GL ideas but handled by a better director and it turned out to be the high point of the series.

Scott.

ScottDS said...

T-Rav -

Ha!

I don't want to open this particular can of worms, otherwise we'll be talking about it every week. That sequence is so good because Lucas knew what he wanted but he also didn't know any better and he probably didn't have much of a choice anyway. (i.e.: He couldn't afford to scrap it and do something else later.)

I don't think it's a secret that the better films were the result of Lucas having to face actual pressure, as opposed to the prequels when he was allowed to do anything he wanted.

It would be interesting to see the rough cut of that sequence. I know for a fact that the rough cut of the cantina sequence, for example, was disappointing so they ended up re-shooting a lot of alien close-up shots after the fact in LA.

ScottDS said...

K -

I have no knowledge of today's classical/avante garde music. Truthfully, I'd be surprised to see film scores regarded so highly in 100 years since they're such a niche interest today. It would take a movie like, say, another Star Wars to bring film music back to the fore. In my experience, most people don't even notice it.

Actually, at the rate things are going, in 100 years, movies will probably be treated the same way we treat classical music today.

ScottDS said...

shawn (and K) -

Yeah, that first shot is something, isn't it? Like Mr. Plinkett said, the way it's shot and the design of the ships tells you everything you need to know about the story and the characters without a hint of dialogue. I've read that when the film was first released, people would boo and hiss Darth Vader yet they had no idea who that was, they only knew the guy in black was the villain!

ScottDS said...

Dave -

Also a great scene! Makes you wonder if a studio would allow a scene like that in a movie today. Though, to be fair, one of the great moments in the prequel trilogy (there are a few!) is in Revenge of the Sith where Anakin and Padme simply stare off from their respective balconies while Williams' music goes dark. It's actually very good.

ScottDS said...

Anon -

And that's why many people prefer Empire to the rest. :-)

Lucas hired a guy not known for sci-fi/fantasy work... but whenever Disney announces a director for the new film(s), chances are it'll be someone well-versed in the genre.

So my question is, who is the modern equivalent of Irvin Kershner? A friend and I were talking about this recently and my vote is for Tom Hooper who directed The King's Speech and several episodes of John Adams. He could direct a new Star Wars film. He may not have experience with FX but he'd be surrounded by people who do.

But we'll save the "Who should direct?" question for another time. :-)

BIG MO said...

Nice! I'll expand more on this later when I'm not on my crapberry. In order:

1) Battle of Hoth (ESB) THE greatest space opera battle of the entire genre (not just Star Wars).

2) Anakin vs Obi-Wan & Sidious vs. Yoda. (RotS) Absolutely incredible.

3) Leia insults Han in the infirmery (ESB)

4) Luke tries diplomacy and force tricks with Jabba, and the gangster responds by dropping him in a rancor pit. (RotJ)

5) The aforementioned scene where Luke gazes longingly on the twin sunsets (ANH)

6) The briefing in the Death Star conference room (ANH)

7) Luke meets the Emperor (RotJ)

8) Darth Maul vs. Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan (TPM)

9) Palpatine tells Anakin the tale of Darth Plagues the Wise (RotS)

10) Obi-Wan vs. Jango Fett on Kamino, both their face-to-face meeting and the platform battle. (AotC)

I have many more, but I'll spare you :)

ScottDS said...

BIG MO -

Good call, though I don't know if I'd label all of those "best" moments. :-D

Re: #2, I prefer Sidious vs. Yoda. As much as I like the Anakin vs. Obi-Wan fight, it goes on for a tad too long and by the end, it's all reduced to a cartoon (don't they surf on the lava at some point?).

Re: #8, now you're talking! Even people who hate the movie love Darth Maul.

Re: #10, I only wish it had been better written but I actually kinda like the Obi-Wan: Detective aspect of Attack of the Clones.

Anthony said...

I used to think lightsabers were the coolest thing I'd ever seen and I love Luke's first battle against Darth Vader. Darth Vader cuts off his hand and literally tells him 'I am your daddy punk!'. Pure ownage before the term was coined.

Their second battle was also great, but I didn't have much use for later (earlier?) lightsaber battles in part because they were too CGtastic, in part because my loathing for those movies knows no bounds.

Tennessee Jed said...

O.K., as someone who grew up with Science Fiction Theater, Flash Gordon, as a youngster, the the original Star Trek in college, I have a little different perspective. When Star Wars was released in 1977, I was taking my oldest son (Andrew's age) to see it while vacationing in Wrightsville Beach, N.C. on a rainy afternoon.

Given that, they had me at the credit scroll and "Obiwan, your my only hope." So, I'd have to say, the early Industrial Light and Magic technology that allowed the vehicle on Tatooine to actually appear like it was gliding above the ground. Then, the first time Millenium Falcon went warp. For you younger guys, it probably seems like your technological birthright. For me, it was truly a quantum leap.

rlaWTX said...

anytime Leia is sassing Han. and vice versa. I remember being afraid that Leia & Luke would "end up together" because I liked Han Solo better. (yeah, I'm a girl)


OT: Last night on "Castle" there was a murder at a scifi convention and there were some awesome lines. At one point Castle (Nathan Fillion) is listing "good" scifi, and he said (ish) "like Star Wars, ..., and that Joss Whedon series". The bad guys on the "TV show" where the murder happened were the "Creavers" - mean, cannibalistic monsters. Castle kept doing William Shatner impressions. And Shatner sang the closing song... it was fantastic fun.

tryanmax said...

I'm most excited by the aliens and robots, so for me the best scenes are the interior of the Jawa sandcrawler and, of course, the Mos Eisley spaceport cantina, both from the original. The scene inside Hutt Palace from Jedi is another favorite. After that, it all degenerates into Ewoks. Pthzz!

The prequel trilogy doesn't compare. The "roomful of creatures" effect is greatly diminished when you know they are all just CGI. If I had to throw some love to the prequels, I'd spotlight the lightsaber battle between General Grevious and Obi Wan Kenobi.

Tennessee Jed said...

rlaWTX, that was a fun Castle last night with Fillion imitating the Shat. I liked Beckett being outed as a fangirl in a costume. I must admit, this show has a delicious sense of humor, and seems to have found a way of solving the problem of surviving the two lead characters romantic involvement without ruining the dynamic.

K said...

ScottDS: Not familiar with classical music? Dude, you're missing a huge cultural treat. It's sort of like beer, you have to develop the taste, but once you have .......

Here's a teaser:
Vivaldi



K said...

ScottDS: Oops. You said "today's" classical music. Okay, now where's that "Edit" button?

darski said...

Must be my advanced age but I can't really remember any scenes vividly. I remember snippets of actual scenes but I tend to remember the overarching storyline and only for the real first 3 movies. I hated the first prequel so much I walked out as soon as that Padma person was introduced. She was the love interest for that 8 yr old boy? --- time to take a shower :P

I'll follow along for this series but I don't expect to contribute much.

Individualist said...

One of the most tear jerking scenes had to be after Jabba had forced Luke into the Pit and he managed to kill the giant dragon monster. When the trainer ran up to it tears in his eyes.

Never before on screen has a man's freindship with a monster been better playacted. Moving!

ScottDS said...

K -

Yeah, I said "today's" classical music. :-)

I'm actually a huge classical music fan... have been since I was a little kid though I confess my knowledge is limited and I'm not at the point where I can listen to a new piece and immediately identify the composer!

Tennessee Jed said...

Vis-a-vis Kit's comments, I am reminded of what the great Stanley Kubrick famously said: "However good our film composers may be, we must remember they are not Beethoven, Mozart, or Brahms." Without appearing to dis' John Williams, I cannot help but think of Kubrick's use of the Blue Danube Waltz by Johan Strauss, or Franz Schubert's Piano Trio in E Flat in Barry Lyndon. Two disparate films, two classical compositions, both used to great effect.

Tennessee Jed said...

Oh, and let's not forget Luigi Bacherini's "Night in Seville" at the end of Master & Commander.

Tennessee Jed said...

But Scott, I agree today's classical music is too atonal for my taste. The subtleties of the western tonal scale had pretty much been fully developed within the context of the sonata allegro form and 19th century Romantic era symphonic expression. I always felt I had a pretty eclectic musical taste, but must admit Igor Stravinsky and subsequent taxes me to listen. When living in Minnesota in the 80's John Adams was the artistic chair at the St.Paul Chamber Orchestra. I tried my hardest to like Nixon in China, I truly did. It just didn't happen though. Ralph Vaugn Williams . . . maybe.

rlaWTX said...

Jed, yep, I was a bit worried when they decided to "consummate" their relationship, but they are playing it well... Every once in a while there is a political tinge - but it's written in H'wood by libs, so I can deal with it.

Tennessee Jed said...

pretty nominal compared to some shows. The arc about the nuke in Gotham comes to mind, but it is not a severe offender.

BIG MO said...

rlaWTX, Jed, my wife and I love Castle and I laughed all the way through last night's episode. Nice cameo from Armin Shimmerman, a.k.a Quark.

Tennessee Jed said...

Mo - that was another nice touch for certain :)

Individualist said...

Oddly enough, although it was comic relief one of the best lines of the prequels was when Obiwan says "You don't want to sell me Death Sticks"
"I don't want to sell you death sticks"
"As a matter of fact you want to go home and rethink your life"

Tennessee Jed said...

Mo - that was another nice touch for certain :)

BIG MO said...

Looking over my 10-point list from above, I'll expand on two of them:

Prequel trilogy best scene: Anakin woos Padme in Clones. "I'm haunted by the kiss you should never have given me." Man, what girl wouldn't fall for that smooth line?

I kid, I kid. Seriously, from Revenge of the Sith: Palpatine tells Anakin the tale of Darth Plagues the Wise. Of all the performances in the prequels, Ian McDiarmid consistently delivered the best -- by far. And what a range: the smooth politician, the shadowy conspirator, the manipulative teacher, the unleashed Sith lord relishing killing Mace Windu and cackling while fighting Yoda ... He should have been at least nominated for best supporting actor, I think.

Original trilogy best scenes: The psychological battle between Luke and the emperor in Jedi:

Emperor: “From here, you will watch the final destruction of the Alliance, and the end of your insignificant rebellion.” (Looks down at Luke’s light saber on his chair.) You want this… don’t you. Good. The hate is swelling in you now. Take your Jedi weapon. Use it. I am unarmed. Give in to your hatred … With each passing moment, you make yourself more my servant!”

Luke (Hesitates, looks at the battle in progress, then turns back to the emperor): “No.”

Emperor: “It is unavoidable. It is your destiny. You, like your father, are now mine.

Marvelous.

And when you think about it, Lucas recreated this scene in ROTS, something I think he doesn’t get enough credit for: In both cases, we have Palpatine / the Emperor watching – and prodding – the light saber fight between his current apprentice (Dooku in Sith and Vader in Jedi) and his intended replacement (Anakin in Sith and Luke in Jedi). When the intended replacement defeats the current apprentice, Palpatine makes “the offer”: Kill your opponent and join me.

In Sith, Anakin gives in and executes Dooku – with some prodding by Palpatine, who commands “Do it!!” Later, Anakin becomes the apprentice in full. But in Jedi, Luke refuses to kill Vader and rejects the offer. The difference? Motivation. In Sith, Anakin is greedy and wants power because he believes he’s been held back by Obi-Wan and the Jedi, but if he can use his full powers, he can stop the war and make everything right. But Luke wants nothing more than to redeem his power. So, Anakin = selfish greed and lust for power and the sacrifice of others, regardless of how he justified it; and Luke = selfless sacrifice and love.

Anyway, my long-winded two cents and change.

EricP said...

Anytime an Ewok dies. That's multiple, so more directly to the question of a moment, Han shouting, "Then I'll see you in hell!" before going out into the Hoth tundra to rescue Luke. We knew he already had a soft spot after returning in Star Wars to enable the kid to blow that thing and go home, but risking his life more directly showed how selflessly heroic Han could be.

ScottDS said...

I'm going to chime in later - I'm at work right now, then it's off to school.

Hopefully Andrew will show up to hold down the fort. :-)

AndrewPrice said...

K, It is definitely a spectacular opening!

Dave, That is a fantastic moment for capturing the feel of the character. I love that shot and the music is what makes it!

AndrewPrice said...

Scott, That was indeed a heck of a way to end the film. It made you really anxious to see Jedi because it left you with this amazing cliffhanger!

PikeBishop said...

During that nail-biting raid on the Death Star, when Vader is locking in on Luke and his wingman explodes in a ball of flame, followed by Solo's "Yee hah."

One of the ten most thrilling moments I have ever experienced in a movie theatre, bar none.

AndrewPrice said...

Big Mo, I'm sensing that you enjoy the entire series! LOL!

AndrewPrice said...

Anthony, Darth Vader cuts off his hand and literally tells him 'I am your daddy punk!'. Pure ownage before the term was coined.

LOL! Bravo! :)

AndrewPrice said...

Jed, Those moments captured my imagination, that was for sure. I personally don't think the effects in Star Wars have ever been beat. They were so amazingly believable! You could honestly believe this stuff existed somewhere out there.

AndrewPrice said...

rlaWTX, I think it's funny that Star Wars totally starts with this idea of Luke and Leia being a match and then it changes so quickly. Scoundrels always finish first!

AndrewPrice said...

tryanmax, I love the dirt and clutter and reality of the Star Wars universe, all of which vanished in the prequels.

Tennessee Jed said...

yeah, Andrew--and actually, I didn't mean credit scroll, rather the "long ago scroll, and entire opening sequence"

AndrewPrice said...

darski, I have to agree, there's something really creepy about the whole Padme/Anekin relationship. Not to mention, it feels entirely fake.

AndrewPrice said...

To the classical music people, I firmly believe that the film scores will be remembered as our generation's contribution to classical music. I used to go to the Kennedy Center in DC and they tried to force modern crap in between the classic stuff we had come to see. People hated it. They would stay outside and chat in the lobby rather than listening to those pieces. Nobody does that with film scores.

AndrewPrice said...

Eric, Very nice! LOL! The Ewoks really are annoying aren't they? At least he didn't flood the screen with hundreds of "Howard the Duck" characters.

AndrewPrice said...

Big Mo, I had such a hard time liking the prequels on so many levels that I wasn't able to see much good in any of those scenes. A couple moments were nice, but all in all, it all just felt flat to me.

AndrewPrice said...

PikeBishop, I remember seeing that moment in theaters for the first time and I remember holding my breath... it was that tense. :)

rlaWTX said...

poor Ewoks...

annoyedelephants said...

The final lightsaber duel between Vader and Luke.

Anonymous said...

Thinking of the Prequels the best moment of them for me was in ROTS when Anakin kills the 'young-lings'. I actually said 'finally' out loud in the cinema (and I'm pretty hard core about not talking at the cinema) because finally we got to see Darth Vader and we got rid of the whining Anakin.

I still say that Anakin should have been introduced as a young adult and not a kid. And he should have turned to the dark side at the end of the first movie or at the latest half way during the second. Because we all knew that he was going to do it and to drag that out over two and a half movies was cruel. If GL had of done it earlier, from then on he could tell a new story.

BIG MO I really liked you point 6 -
The briefing in the Death Star conference room (ANH) where we get to see the power of the force which was very intriguing.

Scott.

AndrewPrice said...

Scott, That was probably the first moments in the prequels where I actually felt Lucas finally got some emotion into the character. Before that he was whining about killing some sandpeople who killed his mom and that was supposed to make him evil somehow? How?!

ScottDS said...

Darski -

No worries and feel free to follow along! Your comment about Padme being the love interest for an 8-year old brings to mind one comment I've read on more than one occasion: Lucas should've started the prequels with Anakin as a teenager already - there's only so much you can do with a little kid.

ScottDS said...

Indi -

I never quite reacted the same way you did to the death of the rancor and his master's sorrow. :-)

I guess it just goes to show you that filmmakers can never predict how someone will react to a movie. But it's those little moments that are more or less missing from the prequels - those human touches.

ScottDS said...

Jed -

I've submitted a debate question to Andrew: "Best use of existing music in a movie" and it seems you'll have plenty to say if and when we get to it.

I enjoy Prokofiev and Shostakovich myself - must be my Russian ancestry. :-)

I'd love to build a great classical collection one day but I find the problem is figuring out, not what music to buy, but what recordings. Which conductor? Which orchestra? Etc.

ScottDS said...

Indi -

Re: death sticks, I always liked that moment.

I've submitted a question to Andrew "Best non sequitur line" in a Star Wars movie. I like "Bounty hunters… we don't need their scum!" myself. :-)

ScottDS said...

BIG MO -

"The sand… it's so smooth…" I can't even remember enough of the line to mock it! :-D

I agree… Ian McDiarmid was the highlight of those movies, even if he was less than subtle at times. And kudos to Lucas for hiring a young actor to play the emperor in Jedi, knowing or perhaps not knowing he'd be needed more than decade later.

I always thought the killing of Dooku at the beginning of Sith seemed tacked on. I can't explain it - it certainly wasn't as powerful as the Luke/Vader/Emperor scenes in Jedi. I mean, we' have this long (and awesome) space battle, then we find Palpatine and Dooku, then all of a sudden they're in a rush to leave. It just isn't set up very well, not to mention the constant inter-cutting between this serious stuff and the R2-D2 Comic Relief Hour in the shuttle bay. :-)

ScottDS said...

EricP -

Great call on the Han line!

ScottDS said...

Pike -

Nail-biting, indeed! I only wish I could've been there opening night in 1977 to see it with an audience for the first time.

As much as I complain about certain changes in the Special Editions, it was nice to be able to see the films in theaters with my friends.

ScottDS said...

Anon/Scott -

I'm surprised… some people hate the killing of the younglings. They feel that scene makes the character irredeemable. I don't know where I stand - it's certainly powerful, though.

And I agree… as I said above, Anakin should've been introduced as a teen and we could see him as a normal, happy kid. Right now, he goes from annoying kid to annoying teen to evil - we never get to see him just be normal!

ScottDS said...

Jed -

I totally didn't see your ILM comment. Birthright, eh? Interesting.

It certainly was a quantum leap from what came before. Hell, look at Star Wars, then look at Logan's Run which was released only a year before. Huge difference.

But my generation is the last to know FX without CGI. I have fond memories of cloud tank FX and Tesla-style lightning bolts which had to be hand-animated.

annoyedelephants said...

The younglings murder was extreme and part of the problem I had with the prequels, where emotional development happened at the speed of light. Much like in "Clones", where Anakin and Padme fall in love and get married over the course of 3-4 days or so, here, Anakin suddenly chooses to join the Sith and immediately goes back to his home for the past few years and starts slaughtering children?

Honestly, I think it should've played out as Anakin uses the force and the troopers to destroy parts of the building as a normal course of battle and, afterwards, hears the dying cries of the children he'd (and we'd) forgotten about until something collapsed on them. Doing so would've A) been more realistic; B) given him a root to his pain and confusion - further pulling him into the Dark Side; C) given producers an out for finding new Jedi in the SW galaxy in the interim period; and D) would've still accomplished the goal of turning him to the dark side.

AndrewPrice said...

annoyedelephants, I agree completely with that. While the killing of the younglings works in the sense of finally making Vader evil, it comes so suddenly and so out of character that it doesn't fit the flow of the film and it feels added on... it doesn't work within the story.

Also, I guess I should mention that it also seems out of character with Vader. Vader is not nutjob. He's a ruthless man with a bad ideology. He's not maniacal. Yet, the way this is presented really makes him come across as maniacal more than anything.

PikeBishop said...

Not to change direction here but what does it say about the character of Anakin, that after he becomes a Jedi, he never bothers to buy his own Mother out of slavery?

And, am I the only one who saw "sparks" between Mrs. Skywalker and Qui Gon in the TPM?

ScottDS said...

Pike -

Andrew replied to you in the wrong thread. Here is his reply:

"PikeBishop, That always struck me as a HUGE character flaw in the story. First, I can't imagine the Jedi would leave his mother as a slave. Talk about a stupid thing to do when you're training someone who you think could be historically significant.

But then he leaves her as a slave too? How messed up is that? Yet, he care later? The whole thing makes no sense."

annoyedelephants said...

In Anakin's defense, maybe he didn't have any money with which to buy her. I imaging Jedi training is a little more intense than your average Women's Studies bachelors, and he may simply haven't had enough time. There's plenty of excuses I could go through, and it's Lucas' negative pile that he didn't even address one of them.

Again, I point back to the "romance" in episode 2. It wouldn't have been difficult to write the script in such a way as to hint at a much longer, secret relationship between Anakin and Padme. It would've gotten rid of all the cheesy lines and would've made for a more satisfying conclusion at the wedding instead of the "what the hell just happened" moment. But Lucas, sadly, decided to manhandle his own ideas through without any filters like Lawrence Kasdan to block the junk.

And no, you weren't the only one who caught the sparks. That's what happens when you have a couple of top-notch actors like Liam Neeson and Pernilla August who understand the value of subtlety, even with a director as ham-handed as Lucas.

AndrewPrice said...

Scott, Apparently, I did. Thanks. PikeBishop, Here is what I wrote:


PikeBishop, That always struck me as a HUGE character flaw in the story. First, I can't imagine the Jedi would leave his mother as a slave. Talk about a stupid thing to do when you're training someone who you think could be historically significant.

But then he leaves her as a slave too? How messed up is that? Yet, he care later? The whole thing makes no sense.

AndrewPrice said...

annoyedelephants, It still strikes me as phony. If it was my mom, I'd get her out one way or another -- money or violence.

annoyedelephants said...

You're dead on. It IS phony and, like I said, while I can come up with excuses, it's to Lucas' detriment that he did not. Something like "he was a child locked in a monastery for 15 years" would make sense, especially given his drive to find his mother the minute he's freed from Obi-Wan's watchful eye. The fact that Lucas didn't explore this is just more evidence of his late weakness as a writer.

AndrewPrice said...

annoyedelephants, Exactly. A decent writer would either have avoided the problem or would have exploited it in a way to give the character some depth. Lucas never seemed to notice the problem.

ScottDS said...

Anndrew, et al -

Apologies if this was mentioned before but re: the romance, I remember the RLM review where he said it would've been more intersting if Padme had pressured Anakin into a relationship instead of the other way around.

Anonymous said...

I always thought the 'journey to the dark side" was far better portrayed in Spiderman 2 via James Franco's character. Why, he even puts on a mask as the end!

As for best moment, in Empire, the scene where Luke leaves Degoba and ObiWan and Yoda are left staring into space with the light of Luke’s X-Wing shinning on their faces, contemplating how bad things just became.
djskit

AndrewPrice said...

djskit, I've actually had a similar thought about Harry Potter. The Harry Potter story could easily be made into a pretty strong origin story for Vader, certainly much stronger than what Lucas created.

AndrewPrice said...

Scott, It might have helped. Frankly, I think the whole thing was just set up wrong. There was no life in their romance and no reason to believe it, just as he never acted like a powerful Jedi or as someone who turned evil rather than went through teenage menopause.

Loyal Goatherd said...

A month late and 30 dollars short, threedonia was eating your dust over here on Nov 26th and I posted this there:

As gold squadron begins its attack run, gold leader takes in gold 2 and gold 3. After 2 fighters are destroyed, the survivor calls to red leader, “they came from behind”, that pilot identifies himself as gold 3. Red leader responds “Copy, gold leader”. Of course, I saw that as a filmmakers’ error on my first viewing. On the second viewing, I saw it for what I believe was the intention of Mr. Lucas, a battlefield promotion (shortlived as it was, for he died as gold leader seconds later). That respect, one warrior to the other, in that dialogue spoke volumes of Mr. Lucas’ respect for the WWII generation and their efforts. He tried to capture a little piece of that and present it to a new generation. Most folks do not even notice this little subtlety. I think it makes the movie. (SW:IV)

AndrewPrice said...

Loyal Goatherd, I admit that I did not notice that. Thanks! :)

I have to check out Threedonia... I've been so busy lately I haven't gotten around much on the net.

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